this is how i made my staff!!!

topic posted Tue, March 20, 2007 - 1:11 AM by  Ed
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hi,iv been kinda running around crazy!!!but i can help with making your staff:)if you look in my friends for a guy named silence he hepled me and was real nice and had lots of good ideas:)but i can totaly help also seeing that i made my own and its titts!!!!!!!!!ok so you will need a aluminum tube about 5 ft and a wooden dowl thats about 3ft that fits snuggly into the aluminum tub! you will also need a heat resitsant glue!!i used JB weld!!and some wick (you can get this online at house of poi)i like the 4in by 36in get two! 6 screws and 6 washers make sure that you get stainles hardwhere,electrical tape in three colors(thay sale a pack that has 5 colers get this one so you can use it to make your own marks for referance!!and i like to use tennis racet tape for my grips!! but you can use hockey tape also!!!and white elmers glue!!! ok here we go(and please feel free to call me if you need)first cut the wooden dowl in half make sure its even!!! then use the JB weld to glue the dowls into both ends of the tube!!make sure to use a good amount of it and use the same amount on both ends(the idea is to try to keep it balenced) (also push the dowls in so there flush) let it set up over night!! next get out a ruler and a drill, mesure the wick so as to make three even spaces,mark them!!now do the same on the staff!!! now drill small holes in the marks on the staff(make them just a little smaller than the screws, but just!!!now roll the wicks around the shaft,fold over the last few inches so it will not unraval!!!use something small and sharp to find the holes in the staff though the wicks and screw them down tight!!!now you need to find the center point of the staff !!i used the back of a chair!!when you find it mark it!!now use the tennis tape to cover the staff starting at the center point and working out!!tape the ends down good with the colored tape(i used yellow for the center and red for the outside end!!! now you need the glue the wicks with the white glue!!use the glue on the flat ends only!!!put one layer of glue on and let dry,then put another layer on and let it dry also!!!! now to set the glue you need to light it up!!!so dip the ends it white gas(coleman fuel) light it up and let it burn its self out!! let it cool!!!!!!!!!thats it:)
posted by:
Ed
offline Ed
St. Louis
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  • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

    Tue, March 20, 2007 - 3:09 PM
    I'd skip the JB weld next time, just use tight fitting wood (or get a piece to large and shave down) - not that it is a problem, just not needed.

    Glad it worked out for you, ed.
    • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

      Tue, March 20, 2007 - 3:56 PM
      Personally I just like a wood staff with aluminum flashing at the end, for body contact that metal will get hot and leave nasty burns. Trust me I know first hand, and it is less labor intensive. You can get ever thing you need expect wicking at home depot. Some fininshing nails to hold your flashing in place, a couple of wood screws in through the aluminum and wicking. Your done. Tape it for grip or looks your choose. no glue no shaving anything down, just simple.
      • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

        Tue, March 20, 2007 - 4:43 PM
        JB Weld is so the wood doesn't burn when you light up . . .

        A wood staff is heavier, not as durable, and not as easy to weight at the ends substantially. If you use grip tape,on aluminum tubing, and wooden dowels inside the heat dispersion is neglible . . . and the weighting is better for spinning . . .

        but . . . that's just my opinion . . .
        • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

          Tue, March 20, 2007 - 5:01 PM
          How durable do you need it to be your not hitting people with it, and the heat still will move down metal, it's a property of metal to transfer heat, Balancing a wood staff ti is already balanced as long as you use the same amount of flashing and wick on each end I have used metal staffs with wood inside of them and still it has transfered heat, it really comes down to a matter of the spinner on what they use. But I can put a staff together in less then 30 mins without waiting for glue and be spinning it right when I'm done.
          • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

            Tue, March 20, 2007 - 5:50 PM
            Yeah it just depends what ya like . . .

            Wood is heavier though, and will burn too, even with flashing. . . I don't have any problems with heat convection on my tubing either hmm . . . I just use long grip tape . . . but ya it all works . . .

            Has any body tried that bit about white gluing the wicks ??
            Does that work ?? Does it stop fraying ??
            • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

              Wed, March 21, 2007 - 3:10 AM
              I tend to fold my wicks in half so that when I am wrapping them around the staff it is twice every time I go around instead of once and then I have a beautiful fold waiting for me when I am finished instead of a frayable end... if you do not want to do that then just fold the last five or 6 inches under before you screw the wicking to he staff... either way will prevent fraying...
  • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

    Wed, March 21, 2007 - 6:24 AM
    ok, a lot of steps on this are kind of unneccisary.

    the screws that hold the wick will hold the dowels in place. the aluminum will really prevent the dowels from burning, so all you really need to do is cut dowels to length, slide them in, wrap the wick, and drill. mcp has an article about it on her website.

    and about wood staves: if you cap the ends of a metal staff (put dowels in them) it wont heat up that bad, and just physically, metal is better for contact, because its light and hollow, and you can weight the ends, so the staff becomes very end heavy, which makes contact staff significantly easier, its like take a hollow tube, and add weights to the end and spin it, then try taking a plain stick, like a martial arts staff, and try doing contact with that.
    • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

      Wed, March 21, 2007 - 12:28 PM
      I agree, the screws in the dowel will hold it in. I prefer to pre-drill the tube, insert the dowel, drill a smaller guide hole in that, then wrap the wick over that. The hole is then located with an awl or pick. Either way works though. Folding the outer edge of wick in should always be done (it is easy), and white glue to cover the screw caps (making them less heat conductive) and the outer wick edge (slowing fraying, but it must be done several times to get a good layer, and it doesn't last forever. The glue must be allowed to cure for a couple days, and then burned (not practiced with/dropped a bunch of times before the burn). The white glue really will form a resinous layer that is heat resistant. Kevlar stitching also helps, but I usually do that later as the wick starts to degrade, since it is more effort and doesn't do much to prevent early fraying on tube wicks.

      I think burns from metal tubes vs burns from metal tape or shielding are sort of a wash, I've gotten both, but thick aluminum staffs don't seem to get quite as hot as thin aluminum staffs or metal tape. Then again, I've gotten much better, so maybe I just don't slide off much anymore. I have sustained two pretty bad burns, one from each - which were much worse than the burns I've gotten from anything aside from zip-poi cables, so I'm not just speculating.

      A thin, say 3/4" aluminum tube is much easier to contact than wood, since a wooden staff must be thicker or it will be fragile. Tubes also allow weight to me distributed further towards the ends, making the staff behave physically as if it is longer, ie slowing the speed of rotation while maintaining momentum, which allows contact to be done at slower speeds. Thin diameter is also helpful because for each rotation (roll) of a staff on the body the travel distance will be less, making steves and such easier. I started on wood, and can contact wood, but switching helped me a lot, even now if I go back to one of my old wood staffs.

      Depending on the thickness and type of aluminum tube used, they can be light or heavy, and can be actually more durable than wood. I've made staffs for people as solid as 3'4" diameter 3/16" wall 6061 T6 aluminum, which loses some of the end-weighting advantages of thinner tube but is basically indestructible, though 1/8-1/16" wall 6060 T6 seems more than strong enough. Lower grades of aluminum are much cheaper, but are prone to bending, so it is a judgment call. I've also made two staffs that had actual weights in the ends under the wick, making them even more end heavy, allowing for a unreal ability to do slow motion contact, but they have drawbacks as well. I sell most of the staffs I make, and they are all for people moving into contact, so this style of staff is for a pretty specific application. Weighting a staff for contact also forces a spinner into better planes, since the momentum of the staff is more difficult to disturb, but they really take a while to accelerate of change planes, and have a much slower top speed.
      • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

        Thu, March 22, 2007 - 6:02 AM
        nice post silence! :D
        • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

          Thu, March 22, 2007 - 10:17 AM
          Thanks... if only I looked over my spelling and grammar before posting. That was 6061 aluminum in both cases, and when I refer to staff diameter, outer diameter was the value given.
          • Unsu...
             

            Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

            Thu, March 22, 2007 - 10:12 AM
            I have been building titanium staves for a while now. It's slightly harder to drill and work with but makes a very nice staff. The biggest advantage to titanium, besides the weight and durability, is that it transfers almost no heat. After a 3-1/2 to 4 minute set I can still hold the staff within about 1/2 of an inch from the burning wicks.
            • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

              Thu, March 22, 2007 - 2:59 PM
              I've heard about titanium being a poor conductor.

              Do you have a good source of Ti tube? What is the cost range for a 5' tube, approximately?
              • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                Thu, March 22, 2007 - 2:32 PM
                Yeah, me too! ME TOO! I want a titanium staff too!!!!
                • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                  Tue, March 27, 2007 - 4:05 AM
                  I bought my first (Xpensiv) ti tube for contact and i'm so in love with it allready...
                  I just can't built the staff yet,
                  .lol.
                  i
                  't been one month !! I'm stiil wondering where can i find the best material to honor it !
                  immortal kevlar? leather and silicon gripp hybrid ??
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                    Tue, March 27, 2007 - 10:23 AM
                    I do leatherwork, and as pretty as it can be, tennis grip is better, not that I haven't made staffs that are more pretty than they are functional.

                    I'm partial to the kevlar from Riz, but in large part due to price, but is it good wick (As far as I know, all kevlar comes from the DuPont mill, regardless of what happens to it later).
              • Unsu...
                 

                Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                Thu, March 22, 2007 - 9:24 PM
                I will dig the paperwork out of the basement and let you know what I am paying tomorow... Also, coming soon is my threaded titanium breakdown staff. No wobble. No rattle. all welded and super tough and super light.
                Let you know tomorrow on the tube price
                • Unsu...
                   

                  Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                  Sat, March 24, 2007 - 4:25 PM
                  Okay, sorry that took so long, I have been busy creating a crazy new fire costume for an upcoming show. (fire lizard) I spend about $95.00 for a 5' pc. of 5/8" titanium. Yeah, it's super expensive but it makes a beautifully weighted staff. Especially for contact cause the weight is mostly out on the ends and very little on the staff itself. It really tends to keep it's own momentum going well. And, again, conducts almost no heat.
                  Anyway, if you are interested, the source I have been using is a guy called Titanium Joe up in Canada. You can look him up by searching that name. He ships quick and generally has a great supply of grade 9 annealed tubing up there. (ANNEALED grade 9 is important for the toughness)
                  The stuff is a lot like working with stainless steel. It drills just fine but keep the drill RPMs down and keep a good amount of pressure on the bit. It will help.
                  If you get some and you need to pick someones brain for info on working with it let me know... Glad to help out.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                    Sat, March 24, 2007 - 10:19 PM
                    all i have to say is FUCKING YAY! don't really care if the first point worked "best" or at all. i'm just super stoked about all the conversation it started, options and more importantly SPECIFICS as far as building.

                    sweet guys, thanks!
                    *toddles off to start planning a contact staff...unless McGuiver beats me *cough cough* to it*

                    ;)
                    • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                      Thu, March 29, 2007 - 6:02 PM
                      Ok-- please dont snarl-- just here to learn- But with the the wicks and attachments you are talking about ( just to get it pictured in mah `ead) the staff I have ( which is wooden, too heavy/ thick for me thus far and has the wicks wrapped in a tight beehive & attached to the end of the staff) is different than what you are describing for wicks, right? here you all are saying that the wick would actualyl be wrapped aroudn the end of the tubing and then the end would be open (with the exception of the dowls that are in there)? Is that right? Does that make it hotter or not at all?

                      thanks!
                      • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

                        Thu, March 29, 2007 - 8:13 PM
                        Yeah, a tube wick is just wrapped around the circumference of the staff, forming a cylinder shaped wick, with the end of the staff exposed. Unless you have a bunch of metal tube (staff) sticking out the end, no worries about the end being hot, since there is little chance of touching it (unless it is a doublestaff or a short staff where buzzsaw/inside-the-arms type tricks make that possible, but still a low risk). Basically most people use tube wicks because they are easy to do, and they work fairly well. I've seen cathedrals, and thought about monkey fists, as staff wicks, but most don't bother.
  • Re: this is how i made my staff!!!

    Sat, November 21, 2009 - 8:50 PM
    try instead of just wraping the wick around fold it in half and put the two cut ends and the begining of the wrap . this way when your done wraping the wick the folded end is on the outside so no nasty big bump of frayed ends

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